Side window replacement

Post by **Bruce Fenstermacher** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 3:02 pm

Thinking about replacing my door windows at some pont in the future. Looking at the window frame the pieces are flush riveted together. I can see if I drilled out the rivets and disassembled the fram I'd be able to replace the window.

I just don't see how I'd buck the new rivets on assembly or how the factory did it.

I'm sure many out there in forum land have done this. How'd you do it?

AR Dave · Post by **AR Dave** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 4:38 pm

Hazey, Cloudy, Scratched?
Can yours be restored?
The window polisher fellar, that restored mine, will be at Petit Jean.
Just a thought.

Post by **Bruce Fenstermacher** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 4:52 pm

Well Dave if he can fix mine it'll be a miracle. And he'll get a chance cause I doubt if I'll get to it that soon.

My windows have hundreds of what look like little cracks. They are all internal and can only be seen in the right light at the correct angle. The other day I tried to make one spread but couldn't so I'm not worried about the window coming apart at this point.

N2865C · Post by **N2865C** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 5:41 pm

I just replaced my side windows twice (please don't ask)! We just drilled out the old rivets and put it back together with pop rivets. The windows I got from Great Lakes fit without trimming. The ones from LP needed a lot of trim work. It's probably best to order some new window seal as well.
We were able to buck the rivets in the rear window without removing the headliner, just in case you are thinking about doing them all at once.
jc

N170CT · Post by **N170CT** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 5:52 pm

Bruce,
Replaced all my windows about two years ago and my memory is not the best. Seems to me we used pop rivets in the door window frames to put it back together. I don't think it is necessary to remove all the rivets, I believe you can remove a couple and then spread the frame sufficiently to change out the plexiglas. The back windows ("B" Model) were more of a challenge. From your description of the windows, replacement is the only solution I know of. Polishing ain't likely to help. Good luck, Chuck

AR Dave · Post by **AR Dave** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 6:23 pm

Is that what my mechanic calls weathering?
What causes that? Exposure? Would window covers protect against this?
My plane has, I think, 2 snaps on each side of the front windshield. I was thinking about getting a custom cover made to snap in place.

N170CT · Post by **N170CT** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 7:01 pm

Dave,
I worked at Sierracin/Sylmar for a while some years back and this firm specialized in plexiglas and lexan transparancies for many aircraft. Our studies indicated that most of the damage is caused by direct sunlight and heat. Aging and environmental conditions play a part also but sunlight seemed to be the worse. For this reason, I could never understand those who use reflective materials INSIDE

the aircraft as this subjects the transparancies to a double whammy of sun. Of course, the claim is that reflective materials reduce the cockpit temperature

. I believe one can accomplish the same with an external white/light colored windshield/window cover which offers the added advantage of wicking rain away from some potential leaks. Worked great on my Grumman Tiger which had a propensity for leaking through the canopy. The only problem with an external cover is one of abrasion on the plexiglas in wind, particularly if the inner surface of the cover is dusty or dirty. To solve this, I always washed my windows immediately prior to covering the aircraft and I used a soft terry cloth beach towel as a buffer between the cover and the windshield. My one and a half cents worth. Regards, Chuck

AR Dave · Post by **AR Dave** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 7:42 pm

Much appreciated Info!
Thanks,

N2865C · Post by **N2865C** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:25 pm

N1478D wrote: As for the side window replacement. Those that used pop rivets I have a few questions. Did you use aircraft pop rivets or Ace Aeromotive type? Where the rivets countersunk? If not countersunk did the head interfer with the window closing?

And finally how exactly did Cessna buck the rivets?

My IA just handed me a bunch of pop type rivets and the rivet tool and said here ya go. I think they were cherrymax but don't know for sure. They were not flush and there was plenty of clearance around the frame. It was an easy job that took about an hour. Other things learned: Stretch the window seal fairly tightly and hold it together on the top with about 10" of electrical tape. Spray the seal with silicone spray and it slides into the frame easily.

I have no idea how Cessna bucked the rivets in there????? Mine had been replaced with pop rivets previously.

jc

AR Dave · Post by **AR Dave** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:26 pm

Goodness Joe, did you have a good day at work?

Sounds like the question is - Does the sun have a negative effect beaming down on Plexiglass over a long period of time?
If NO, then there's nothing to worry about.
If YES, then I would have to think that putting a mirror on the dash to reflect the sun back against the under side of the plastic wouldn't be the best ideal. I don't know, I've always left a good layer of snow on my windshield for that purpose. But my daughters tan this way, with a reflective foil sheeting.

N1478D · Post by **N1478D** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:43 pm

AR Dave wrote:Goodness Joe, did you have a good day at work?
Sounds like the question is - Does the sun have a negative effect beaming down on Plexiglass over a long period of time?
If NO, then there's nothing to worry about.
If YES, then I would have to think that putting a mirror on the dash to reflect the sun back against the under side of the plastic wouldn't be the best ideal. I don't know, I've always left a good layer of snow on my windshield for that purpose. But my daughters tan this way, with a reflective foil sheeting.

Dave, it probably doesn't matter how many times sunlight passes thru plexiglass. It does matter how it is treated, cleaned, and if people scratch it - it's scratched. Find me a scientist not related to a cover manufacturer who says sunlight will damage plexiglass. If it doesn't hurt going in, it's not going to hurt coming out. It's the same type of hype that power flow throws out. What are they going to say? It just works, trust me? Covers on the inside or the outside are protecting the interior materials and the panel.

Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:43 pm

Ok the seal on the side window 0511106-103. Is this special. Looks like it could be Spruce 05-1600

Mon Mar 28, 2005 10:51 pm

Never mind. I did a search and of course George already answered the question.

gahorn wrote:The BA-200 (Brown Aircraft PN) is used for both front and back windows and is a suitable replacement for original PN 0511106-103 (Fig 33, item 52) and is the same material as used beneath item 5 and un-identified on Pg. 45.

Please Note: PN 0511106-103 has been superceded at Cessna, and is now available under PN R761483 priced at $1.31/ft. (Yingling 800-854-2647 (http://www.yinglingaircraft.com/) or Hill Aircraft 800-998-7832 (http://www.cessnaparts.com/) can obtain this for you.)

Placed in hot water before installation and stretched tightly around the glass-edge, the seal will conform more easily without crimping.

Of course I don't have any to compare but going by the description Spruce 05-02200 is the same dimension as the Brown BA-200. Browns is a vinyl material @$45 for 25 ft. Spruce is made of duro EPOM (what ever that is) @ $1 ft.

JTS · Post by **JTS** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 2:46 am

Would a well buffed coat of quality wax (Inside and out) not be the best protection for our windshields\side windows? Just curious.

Jody[/b]

N2865C · Post by **N2865C** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 4:59 am

JTS wrote:Would a well buffed coat of quality wax (Inside and out) not be the best protection for our windshields\side windows? Just curious.

Jody

They should know. http://lpaero.com/CAREINS.html