The International Cessna 170 Association

I had an opportunity to make a 180 mile round trip this morning and use my new Scout unit. Basically it appears to work as advertised. I did have an interesting situation occur. I put two iPads in the plane, one for me and one for my co-pilot so we could "see" where the other planes appeared to be. My iPad is about a yr old and is a 4, my other one is a 2 (and obviously older). My Scout is attached to the windshield on the right hand side very near the iPad 2 while the iPad 4 is on the left hand side of the instrument panel. What was strange is the older iPad 2 picked up more aircraft than the iPad 4???. I don't know if the location of the Scout to the iPad 2 is a factor or not. I will experiment next flight to see if either changing the iPads locations or changing the Scout location to see if that has any effect.

I bought the FlightBox from Open Flight Solutions about two weeks ago. It is $225. with GPS, fully assembled. Very happy with it. Works as advertised. As far as I know it does the same as the Scout. Not sure about the GPS in the Scout. Was going to fly with a friend who has a Scout last week to compare the two, but we didn't get to go. The Scout is more compact, but with the FlightBox you don't need a suction cup. It is probably 6s with either one.

Hey, Ken.... bring that thang to the next fly-in so we can see it.

Here's my question. Is there any reason Scout operate any better than the Dual XGPS170 I bought a several years ago?

I was not impressed with ADS-B in then. Maybe it is different now as there are many more ADS-B out transmitters flying around to excite the system and make it work. At the time I found it useless.

I should maybe try mine again but so far it is probably the worst aviation purchase I've ever made.

George, I plan to have it with me at Hilltop Lakes 30 September.
Bruce, I think you should try your unit again. Like you say, there are many more out transmitters out there now.

As always, the best method of mid-air conflicts avoidance, is looking out the windshield/windows for other aircraft IMHO. Flight following is good, but not 100% accurate. From my limited experience using a Stratus portable IN unit and a couple of flights with Scout, you can really see a lot of the other aircraft in your area. Of course this would be even better if all aircraft had ADS-B Out, but many of us don't. It is just another tool to be used to hopefully help us arrive safely. Obviously the geographic area one flies in determines the amount of congestion. We have an aviation school (Middle TN State Univ) at our airport (MBT) along with lots of traffic going into both Smyrna & Nashville. Those units will hopefully be of some assistance while flying into busy breakfasts, but again for now, only a small % of us have ADS-B OUT.

Flying to the Tyler fly-in this last Saturday gave me a chance to view Wendell's Stratus/I-Pad setup and watch nearby traffic during our climb-out past the western Class B of KIAH....

... after a few minutes of observing all the little triangles moving left/right/dead-ahead/etc.... I got scared and quit looking at it, and returned to looking outside and enjoying the flight again.

On another note...
One of the considerations which have been brought up in conversations is the lack of anonymity with certain ADS-B configurations. For example, if one chooses the "replacement transponder" solution (such as the Stratus Txdr or Garmin 330ES or other 1090 solution) ... it could be only a matter of time before FAA, Homeland Security, IRS, FBI, or any other agency will have your airplane tracked and recorded whenever you travel by airplane. This would be a perfect set-up for creating a FEE-based ATC system.

The other solution, such as a UAT system which uses your ordinary pre-existing Mode-C Txdr, ... would still allow one to travel anonymously.

Another issue is,... if ADS-B equipped... and if the ADS-B system fails.... then the aircraft is grounded without an approved MEL (because all installed equipment must be operational to be legal without an approved MEL.)

My old transponder breathed its last on my trip to Alaska last May. The annual was just completed and the neighboring avionics shop said I could go cheap now and replace the transponder again before the ADS-B deadline or just do it right the first time. So I had them bring me into compliance with a transponder from Garmin. I don't recall the model. I just ordered the Scout to be delivered to Kenai, AK, where my airplane is waiting for me to fly it back to TN. I'll set it up and see how well it works on a long cross country. I leave tomorrow for Kenai, will stay a few days to visit friends, and then head back south with it.

Frank... are the MTSU training planes equipped with ADS-B out?

gahorn wrote: On another note...
One of the considerations which have been brought up in conversations is the lack of anonymity with certain ADS-B configurations. For example, if one chooses the "replacement transponder" solution (such as the Stratus Txdr or Garmin 330ES or other 1090 solution) ... it could be only a matter of time before FAA, Homeland Security, IRS, FBI, or any other agency will have your airplane tracked and recorded whenever you travel by airplane. This would be a perfect set-up for creating a FEE-based ATC system.

Privacy has been one of my concerns. I can imagine that I'm flying along, minding my own bidnez, and some over zealous park ranger thinks I disturbed a spotted owl or a bumpy tree frog or something...... next thing I know the jack-booted thugs are at my door to drag me away. I think the days of flying around low and slow may be coming to an end.

You make some very good points to consider George.

Keith, yes the MTSU Diamonds are ADS-B equipped. Not sure about others they might be using. I will be interested in seeing how your Scout preforms.

George, you are correct, in my opinion, that with ADS-B out they (whomever) will be able to track our movements and know specifically what aircraft it is (thus the reason ADS-B must be permanently installed). However if a pilot becomes concerned that he is going to fly somewhere that might bring into question that location, turn the x-ponder off or pull the circuit breaker like you would do now if that same situation were to occur. Granted, you can see a lot of aircraft out your windshield, but you can't see those overtaking you from above, below or behind you. So far my practice, limited so far, has been to see where other aircraft are and their direction and altitude. That way if one is in my area I can do a visual scan for it.

170C wrote:...That way if one is in my area I can do a visual scan for it.

...sure you can.... IF...he hasn't pulled his circuit-breaker also.

The BendixKing 130 system (which is actually a re-labelled FreeFlight system) will allow anonymous flight so that competing businesses cannot see your tail number and track your corporate movements, etc etc... However the literature does not state it prevents ATC from knowing who/what/where you are.

Remember when Social Security Numbers were "Not For Identification Purposes"

I was able to try my Foreflight with Scout for the first time this morning.

A little background.. my new Garmin 335 ADS-B compliant transponder had a problem in that it was reportedly showing that it was airborne even when it was on the ground. Turns out it needed a software update even though it was only a month old. Apparently it was a known issue and Garmin issued the software update to correct it.

So I went on a short flight this morning both to test the transponder and to use the Scout for the first time.

It was early so there wasn't much traffic out there but shortly after takeoff I saw an aircraft symbol displayed on the Foreflight map on the iPad. It was American Airlines 36700 feet above me. The next couple of airplanes I detected were equally out of my area of concern. I'm wondering why it doesn't screen out traffic that isn't possibly a threat.

A little later on I detected two GA aircraft operating near the local airport, and I can see where that info could be useful. Both N numbers were displayed corresponding with the radio calls that the pilots were making so it was easy to determine who was where.

I can't find any info on what it does with excessive traffic data in a congested area. I hope it starts to remove the display for jets in the flight levels when I'm in the low altitude regime. Otherwise, it will become useless with too much clutter.

The jury is still out for me. I'll have to see what benefits it provides when I actually go somewhere with it.

Here is an article that might be helpful. It shows you how to filter traffic on Foreflight.
http://ipadpilotnews.com/2015/10/forefl ... b-traffic/

lowNslow wrote:Here is an article that might be helpful. It shows you how to filter traffic on Foreflight.
http://ipadpilotnews.com/2015/10/forefl ... b-traffic/

Thank you!