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jarnold
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Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2019 2:12 pm

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Post by jarnold »

Hey all,
I'm James. I'm from eastern montana. I'm a welder / fabricator and have recently decided to pursue my ppl. About 7 years ago i flew fairly regularly with my, at the time, boss / company owner, in his 170B. It was a gutted, polished bird, with heavier (like i said i'm knew to terminology) gear legs and bush wheels. He was giving me instruction on some basic maneuvers, and i was younger. I flew one time in the actual pilot seat to a different airport, with him on the right. I hadn't done much ground school if any, as i recall, and on the return trip i'll say the landing scared the hell out of me. On top of it, there were fewer words of encouragement, and more so words of intimidation. Did I mention he was ex military? I can' remember and exact phrasing, but i left me feeling incompetent and like i wouldn't ever be in control of the bird. Needless to say, my flight time fell off.

A year or two following, as our work relation began to suffer, and i began to develop my own plan as a contractor / business owner, we lost contact and i left to bigger and better things. Fast forward 5 years, and i still have this itch in my bones whenever i see a small aircraft above me. I wonder how things would have been had i stuck to it and pushed through it all. Needless to say, I have once again decided to pursue it--this time from a little different angle (here is where i want some input). I decided i wanted to gain as much knowledge as possible before i begin flight instruction again. I want to know (not everything, obviously) as much as i can before i get back into the cockpit in hopes of it easing some of my previous tension / anxiety.

I've been studying my ground school via my previously (2009) Jeppesen Ground school kit as well as following sporty's flight school app on my phone. The app as i'm sure you know consists mainly of videos / bullet points followed by practice quizzes. Anyway, my dream is to once again get into (hopefully my own) 170 and pursue the same sort of setup for back-country landing. I would love to be able to fly in to remote central montana lands for hunting / fishing access with someday becoming proficient in mountain flying. Lastly, I guess the reason i am posting here is i stumbled on this forum, thought it was so cool to find a site dedicated to the 170, and decided to introduce myself as hopefully the next generation of 170 fanatics.

Lastly, i would just like to thank you in advance for your insights / opinions, and look forward to commenting with you all in the future!

James.
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GAHorn
Posts: 20967
Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2002 8:45 pm

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Post by GAHorn »

James, WELCOME to the 170 Assoc’n Forums!

The Int’l Cessna 170 Assoc’n is THE official TYPE CLUB of this model airplane. I encourage you to join the Assoc’n. These Forums consist of some areas free to the public (IE The Pilot Lounge, The Hangar, etc.) but much of the deeper, more technical documentation and Member-privileges are reserved to bona fide Members of the Assoc’n.

The Cessna 170 is the aircraft which established and led to the most numerous and most popular small 4-seat airplane in the world, the Cessna 172 which is still in production. You are joining a group of fellow admirers and enthusiasts of the Cessna 170 models. Again WELCOME!

As a CFI (Certified Flight Instructor) of almost 50 years experience I can tell you that your summarization of your past experience is correct.... the early experiences you’ve suffered at the hands of a coarse introduction to flying did you no favors. Hopefully, all the new friends you will find here will get you over that and back on the road to flying your own 170!
'53 B-model N146YS SN:25713
50th Anniversary of Flight Model. Winner-Best Original 170B, 100th Anniversary of Flight Convention.
An originality nut (mostly) for the right reasons. ;)
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bsdunek
Posts: 425
Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2004 6:42 pm

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Post by bsdunek »

Welcome! You'll find this a friendly, helpful bunch. Hope to see you at the convention next year.
Bruce
1950 170A N5559C
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Bruce Fenstermacher
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Post by Bruce Fenstermacher »

James, welcome. My advice would be to start looking for an instructor. They don't have to instruct in a 170 as they and instructors are somewhat hard to find. A 172 would be perfect though a trike gear aircraft but there are many others that would be fine.

What happened prior is life experience. The good thing to take away is you found something you like and a spark is lit.

Flying is a skill, like welding, that few just pick up without proper training. You have good days and somedays you seem to take steps backwards. Bet you make plenty of bad welds while learning and bet you are still learning every time you weld something. So it will be with flying. You will always be learning something.

Just do it.
CAUTION - My forum posts may be worth what you paid for them!

Bruce Fenstermacher, Past President, TIC170A
Email: brucefenster at gmail.com
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sfarringer
Posts: 309
Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2005 10:49 pm

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Post by sfarringer »

The first instructor doesn't always work out!
Some instructors are great pilots, but poor communicators. Some are marginal pilots but good communicators. Some students learn by seeing, some by hearing. Sometimes the particular student/instructor combination just doesn't mesh.

Try another instructor or two, and I'll bet you find one you can learn from.
Ragwing S/N 18073
jarnold
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Aug 23, 2019 2:12 pm

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Post by jarnold »

Thanks for the kind / encouraging words, all. I have found an instructor here in my hometown, just haven't started the communication. Hopefully next week. He does have a 172 for training, so i'd have to fetch my td endorsement after. He also insinuated there is a possibility of getting a few hours on twins if he ends up hot shotting. Would be pretty cool! I'll keep you all posted. For now, i'm back to the studying. :)
hilltop170
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Joined: Sat May 06, 2006 6:05 pm

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Post by hilltop170 »

Welcome James!
Lots of us have had instructors who could have done a better job. The important thing is you didn't let that stop you. Listen to what each one has to say and there will always be something of value you can use. Take your new instructor up on every opportunity he offers you. You'll pick up valuable knowledge whether you are doing the flying or a passenger. You can learn a lot by watching.

Good luck with your training in whatever plane is available. It's good to fly a mix of different planes. The 170 is a great airplane and there are always some for sale somewhere if you decide to buy one.
Richard Pulley
2014-2016 TIC170A Past President
1951 170A, N1715D, s/n 20158, O-300D
Owned from 1973 to 1984.
Bought again in 2006 after 22 years.
It's not for sale!
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GAHorn
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Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2002 8:45 pm

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Post by GAHorn »

jarnold wrote:Thanks for the kind / encouraging words, all. I have found an instructor here in my hometown, just haven't started the communication. Hopefully next week. He does have a 172 for training, so i'd have to fetch my td endorsement after. He also insinuated there is a possibility of getting a few hours on twins if he ends up hot shotting. Would be pretty cool! I'll keep you all posted. For now, i'm back to the studying. :)

Warning! Stay away from his offer of TWINS! You are NOT interested in TWINS. At least not until you get your private ticket.

An instructor who early-on starts talking about things beyond your present goal is thinking of HIMSELF... not you! HE is hopeful of building twin-time which is NOT YOUR INTEREST at this time! He is NOT FOCUSED on YOU... which is what you want in a CFI.

George - retired, professional CFI.
'53 B-model N146YS SN:25713
50th Anniversary of Flight Model. Winner-Best Original 170B, 100th Anniversary of Flight Convention.
An originality nut (mostly) for the right reasons. ;)
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Bruce Fenstermacher
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Post by Bruce Fenstermacher »

Had the same reaction as George. An offer of ride in a twin cause there is an empty seat is one thing. Training in a twin is another and just confusing your primary goal. And as George alluded, is confusing your instructors goal of best teaching you rather than what ever it is he is suppose to be doing with the twin. Be leery unless this was an innocent offer of a possible simple ride.
CAUTION - My forum posts may be worth what you paid for them!

Bruce Fenstermacher, Past President, TIC170A
Email: brucefenster at gmail.com
jarnold
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Post by jarnold »

It seemed like an innocent offer. I don't believe there was any actual training intention behind it, but rather he does make some chartered runs time to time and if there happened to be an empty seat while i'm learning from him, i would be able to hop in for the ride. Not necessarily intended to subtract from my education. He runs an entire aviation business (he does commercial, ag, etc.) and this sound just like an opportunity should it arise. We will see!
hilltop170
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Joined: Sat May 06, 2006 6:05 pm

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Post by hilltop170 »

When I first started flying, I rented a 65hp PA-11 Cub until I soloed then later traded a motorcycle for a 65hp 1946 Taylorcraft BC-12D with no electrical system or radio. Those two planes were basically all I knew about flying and I was excited to learn everything I could about flying them.

I was also lucky enough to have a primary instructor who also flew as a part-time corporate pilot and invited me along on several occasions to sit right seat and observe his trips. I learned A LOT that transferred over into my early single engine training. It did not foul my single engine training in any way but enlightened me to other areas of aviation I had no idea about. It increased my desire to be an excellent pilot by watching him precisely and professionally operate those complicated aircraft on the ground, in the air, flying in clouds, and executing precision approaches. I learned a lot and marveled at it all while listening to him on the radio "work the system". He even let me fly when no one else was in the plane. It was all very educational and I felt a personal challenge to learn as much as I could as my training progressed. I was encouraged by the experience not stymied or confused by it. And I could not have gotten that early exposure any other way. I am convinced it made me a better pilot.

So I restate my earlier comment, take every opportunity you are offered while building your aviation experience. You be the judge of what is constructive or not.
Richard Pulley
2014-2016 TIC170A Past President
1951 170A, N1715D, s/n 20158, O-300D
Owned from 1973 to 1984.
Bought again in 2006 after 22 years.
It's not for sale!
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GAHorn
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Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2002 8:45 pm

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Post by GAHorn »

jarnold wrote:It seemed like an innocent offer. I don't believe there was any actual training intention behind it, but rather he does make some chartered runs time to time and if there happened to be an empty seat while i'm learning from him, i would be able to hop in for the ride. Not necessarily intended to subtract from my education. He runs an entire aviation business (he does commercial, ag, etc.) and this sound just like an opportunity should it arise. We will see!
My earlier comment was issued under the impression of an instructor anxious to immaturely impress you. Accidents are common among such ventures.

I didn’t consider that his “day-job” might be a professional operation that might provide encouragement and insight to a professional perspective of the industry. Richard’s comments are good ones, and exposure to professional aviation operations are always good (and fun.).
'53 B-model N146YS SN:25713
50th Anniversary of Flight Model. Winner-Best Original 170B, 100th Anniversary of Flight Convention.
An originality nut (mostly) for the right reasons. ;)
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