New 170B owner

How to keep the Cessna 170 flying and airworthy.

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goodair
Posts: 49
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 5:32 pm

Re: New 170B owner

Post by goodair »

Thank you Bruce:

I just purchased the spring kit pictured. It is a Scott part and still has the mounting instructions for the 170 inside. I found it at a local aircraft surplus store at 35$. I would have bought more if he had them. It will be interesting to see what the new tailwheel and springs do to the ground handling. I won't be sorry to see the Maul go. I had a Maul tailwheel on a Champ a while back and hated that thing also.

Next, TIRES. I have been reading here on this site about tires. It will need some soon. The gentleman who sold this aircraft to us was trying to explain how he wanted to install 6 or 8! ply tires, to "tone down" the aircraft. Seems everyone has their opinions but I have always thought that nice soft forgiving tires did the best job of "toning down" an airplane. I owned an S1S Pitts for a while and you could really feel a few extra PSI in the tires on that thing. We used to run them fairly soft. It actually needed toning down:) Not really sure I understand the ply thing, but I don't see any advantage to more than 4 ply in these 2200 lb airplanes. Anyone dissagree?

Thanks again to all for getting us tuned in with the new machine.
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GAHorn
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by GAHorn »

The Type Certificate actually specifies 4-ply rated tires.
'53 B-model N146YS SN:25713
50th Anniversary of Flight Model. Winner-Best Original 170B, 100th Anniversary of Flight Convention.
An originality nut (mostly) for the right reasons. ;)
goodair
Posts: 49
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 5:32 pm

Re: New 170B owner

Post by goodair »

Wow, didn't know that. So it is then prohibited to install 6 ply? That is good to know. They are cheaper anyway:) Web fly mostly on grass and non pavement so even the chep tires seem to last long enough.
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DaveF
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by DaveF »

After I installed 4-ply tires I had to show the TC to my mechanic to convince him it was ok. Saved several pounds using 4 instead of 6.
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ghostflyer
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by ghostflyer »

When I first started my project I down loaded the Type Certificate and plastic laminated it and used it many times as a reference . I had all the experts tell me I could do this and that . I was surprised by all the false information after referring to the TC for guidance. Tires and sizes are referenced very clearly on the TC. “including “ using bigger tires . 90% of my movements are on rough non pavement runways [Bush tracks and beaches] and found the 8.00 tyres are ok,at 25 psi , but lately have been flying a Cessna with 8.5 tyres and feel they have a slight edge and they are at 20 psi .
My biggest issue is finding something that’s LEGAL that will stop mud, sand , slush and cow patties covering my undersurface of the main plane and horizontal tail plane .
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GAHorn
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by GAHorn »

ghostflyer wrote:...
My biggest issue is finding something that’s LEGAL that will stop mud, sand , slush and cow patties covering my undersurface of the main plane and horizontal tail plane .
The LEGAL answer to your problem is called "Wheel Fairings" (or "streamlines" as Cessna used to call them.) :wink:

(Of course, serious mud builds up inside them quickly. On the way to the Bardstown convention I had to stop about 20 miles after departure to remove/clean/re-install my wheel fairings due to the soft field at my home on takeoff. I wanted to remove the mud before it hardened and created a problem several hours later at the first stop.)

I've seen a shroud-type of "fender" on some aircraft many years ago, but not recently and have no idea of the approval basis. I always wanted some that could support the weight of a passenger's foot …. or my own fanny at a fly-in for sitting-upon. Maybe one of our more-adventurous Members will come up with some.
'53 B-model N146YS SN:25713
50th Anniversary of Flight Model. Winner-Best Original 170B, 100th Anniversary of Flight Convention.
An originality nut (mostly) for the right reasons. ;)
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ghostflyer
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by ghostflyer »

Wheel fairings,steamliners, pants, spats ..gosh more nick names than members of our government. I have flown with these “aerodynamic “ aids on other aircraft but found them to be more of a worry than a help. I have seen other aircraft with a plate on top of a wheel used as a step for sky divers but this modification is frowned upon by the authorities and it looks ugly. So the hangar fire hose is used to clean the aircraft but the smell of fresh cow patties linger. Even beach sand sticks to the underside of the wing and horizontal stab.
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n2582d
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by n2582d »

It would be cool to find item 214 of the TCDS -- “Two ‘no drag’ wheel fenders per Liquid Tool Co., ... ." Might be easier to do as John Nielsen has done by using C-188 fenders.
IMG-1404.jpg
Fender.jpg
Fender.jpg (49.94 KiB) Viewed 23562 times
IMG_4245.jpg
Fig.45 '76-'84 C-188 IPC
Fig.45 '76-'84 C-188 IPC
Another (pricey) option -- again not STC'ed for the C-170 -- is Aerotwin's mud flaps.
main_gear_gravel_deflectors_installed.jpg
main_gear_gravel_deflectors_installed.jpg (18.93 KiB) Viewed 23558 times
The merits of these devices are debated here. It looks to me like the fenders wouldn’t help much with protecting the horizontal stab from rock damage. Maybe the solution would be a combination of the two styles— mud flaps mounted on the bottom of the fenders. ... with “Bubba’s Truck Stop” embossed in white on the back of the mud flap. :)
Last edited by n2582d on Mon Nov 05, 2018 3:20 am, edited 3 times in total.
Gary
albspng
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by albspng »

Gary, Do you have the part numbers for the C-188 wheel spat? I need parts 10, 21,& 26 in the illustration you have posted.

Alan B
'53 170B N3161B
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n2582d
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by n2582d »

Alan, Here’s a link to where you can find the C-188 IPC.

45-10 Bracket-UPR Fender LH p/n 1641025-3, when exhausted use (WEU) 1641025-13
Bracket-UPR Fender RH p/n 1641025-4, WEU 1641025-14
45-21 Bracket-LWR Fender LH p/n 1641026-3
Bracket-LWR Fender RH p/n 1641026-4
45-26 That bar is the bottom end of the wire cutter which goes all the way to the top of the gear leg. I’m guessing you don’t need that.

It looks like John had to add a square tubing spacer between the top mount and the fender. Landing gear angle on the C-188 is probably different than that of the C-170. Later model C-188’s have hinged mounting points which might allow one to line up the fender without shims/spacers.
43DAECFB-10D7-4637-B013-6A1E6644C1A1.jpeg
Last edited by n2582d on Mon Nov 05, 2018 2:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Gary
albspng
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by albspng »

Thanks Gary

Alan B
goodair
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by goodair »

Thanks to all who have contributed to our newbie 170 education. We are just loving the plane. With about 20 hours on it already we are learning what we like and noticing some others. One thing that has become evident is that the plane seems to have a cruise prop on it. I need to dig up the numbers for you all but I don’t have the books in front of me.

The prop is getting about 2200 rpm in climb around 80, and if left at full throttle does not get up to redline in level flight. I think we are leaving a lot of climb performance on the table. Since this will be used for mostly short flights with an occasional jaunt more than three hours away, we are thinking of tweaking the prop to a bit more of a climb prop.

The engine has less than 300 since major with good compression and we have checked the normal items like throttle travel, air filters etc. The engine purrs and even at only 2200, the plane climbs decent when loaded light. Cruise speed is probably higher than it will be if we tweak the prop, now 120+ down low, full throttle. I have to check again but I think we are getting around 2500rpm. I also need to check the tach, as this could be the issue. Stock mechanical tach and of course it’s been around a while.

So, while I dig up the numbers of what we actually have on it, can anyone chime in with suggestions to dia and pitch of a prop that works well with the stock 145.
Thanks.
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GAHorn
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by GAHorn »

If you have a spinner... pull it off and look at the hub of the prop to see what it's pitched at now. EX: The usual 8-bolt props are DM or MDM 7655 would be a cruise prop. 7653 is standard. 7651 is climb. I have a 6-bolt, 600 TT EM7651 in no indication of wear which I plan to repitch to 53 unless someone has one similarly already to trade.
'53 B-model N146YS SN:25713
50th Anniversary of Flight Model. Winner-Best Original 170B, 100th Anniversary of Flight Convention.
An originality nut (mostly) for the right reasons. ;)
goodair
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Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 5:32 pm

Re: New 170B owner

Post by goodair »

Did you mean repitch to 53? I will check tomorrow. Mine I would guess its 55 but we will see.
Neal
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ghostflyer
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Re: New 170B owner

Post by ghostflyer »

Ok, George , how much moonshine are you making and have you been sampling the product. It sounds a good product when you want to repitch to 73 in . Or are you running the 170 on moonshine and it can spin a 73 in pitch. The world awaits your wisdom .
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